June 18th, 2008 by Glenn Sacks, MA for Fathers & Families
I've often discussed the issue of the rights of lesbian “social mothers”–women who agreed to employ a sperm donor so that they could have children with their lesbian partners, who are the biological mothers.
I do believe that children fare best when they have both a mom and a dad, and that fathers offer much to children that mothers don’t provide. However, this is not possible in lesbian couples.
When two lesbians agree to have a child together, and when the child has bonded with both his or her biological mother and his or her social mother, I believe that the relationship between the child and the social mother should be protected. I also believe that the biological mother has a responsibility to her children and to her former partner to hold up her end of the deal with the partner with whom she created the child, and that courts should hold her to her commitment.
These cases are now becoming routine. When the relationship goes sour, the lesbian biological mom does to her ex exactly what heterosexual mothers so often do to their ex-husbands--drive her out of her child’s life. When heterosexual women do this, our society makes excuses for them and assumes that the ex-husband must have done something bad to merit it. With these lesbian breakups we can see the truth much clearer--some women (straight or gay) are vindictive, and this vindictiveness drives them to purge their exes from their children’s lives.
In the recent Fairchild custody case, the lesbian couple legally committed themselves to having joint custody, and the biological mother tried to employ the Ohio ban on gay marriage in order to deprive her ex of a role in their child's life. Fortunately she failed, as is discussed in Court rules against gay mom on ending joint custody (Columbus Dispatch, 6/17/08).
One thing that's interesting about some of these cases is that the lesbian biological mothers are so vindictive towards their former partners that they will gladly use anti-gay laws as a way to drive them out of their children's lives.
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14 Responses to “Court Rules Against Vindictive Mother in Lesbian Custody Case”
Note: The views expressed by readers in the reader comments do NOT necessarily reflect those of Glenn Sacks. The fact that the comment is posted on this blog does NOT signify that Glenn Sacks agrees with it.Posters' views are those of the posters alone--Glenn's views can ONLY be found in the blog post itself, not the comments.
While blog commenters are given great freedom on this blog, there are some rules of moderation. To read those, click here.
This case is so clear and so typical. It should serve as a warning to men, women straights and gays. Imagine using anti-gay laws for revenge. I've been away a while but this story places me firmly back into reality. I don't agree with the lesbian lifestyle but I really feel sympathy for the social mothers who are denied visitation. Discounts or excuses for the custodial mother, anyone?
I welcome gay marriages exactly for this reason. When fathers advocates can clearly demonstrate a preponderance of judicial rulings that are equitable between gay couples, judges will have little excuse for continuing punitive law against all social parents, including fathers.
One thing that's interesting about some of these cases is that the lesbian biological mothers are so vindictive towards their former partners that they will gladly use anti-gay laws as a way to drive them out of their children's lives
They will rationalize their choices the same way they rationalize the abuse of the courts they inflict on the fathers. Their partner had it coming, and it was all because she was the best parent for the children. Won't someone think of the children?
Penumbrook
"I welcome gay marriages exactly for this reason. When fathers advocates can clearly demonstrate a preponderance of judicial rulings that are equitable between gay couples, judges will have little excuse for continuing punitive law against all social parents, including fathers."
Be careful what you wish for my friend.
The very nature of some one proclaiming a lesbian life style speaks volumes in itself. It should come as no surprise that the person will say and do anything to support their desirers. Once men make it clear that they will no longer take our current position, women will play a big part in changing the laws. Women (like men) want to be seen as working for good (certainly for the good of the children). As it stands the majority of the people are not paying attention. When this flood gate opens it will come as a complete surprise to many. That is why we can not bad mouth all women. Soon there will come a point when people must take a side and I care not to push anyone away who may be of help.
"When heterosexual women do this, our society makes excuses for them and assumes that the ex-husband must have done something bad to merit it. With these lesbian breakups we can see the truth much clearer--some women (straight or gay) are vindictive, and this vindictiveness drives them to purge their exes from their children’s lives."
Clearly, that kind of abuse (parental alienation) is domestic violence.
My fear is that in establishing social parents as having equal rights with bio parents will put biological fathers at odds with step fathers for "equal rights" in parenting. now you have 2 against 1 in a court battle (parent AND social parent vs. parent) and you knock down a fathers default time to 1/3 to be "fair". I wish I could see the bright side of it like so many here.
I bet NOW is pulling thier hair out over this one since a man is not involved they have no soapbox to rail against the verdict.
I dont think it makes a difference if its a lesbian "social" parent or a father. The courts are more then happy to slap a man with child support even if he is not the biological parent if he "creates a parental bond" with the child and I think that if a few more of these same sex couples start feeling the pain of fathers that awareness and perceptions will change.
Penumbrook and AP said quite well... I see no reason to expound on the obvious. (Another one of those "this is a news flash why?" some of us have been seeing this for years; but now we have someone else here to tell us it's really okay to really believe what we really live with and really see every day)
Gunner ARetired
Just maybe, at least I am kind of hoping but not expecting that things might start to change for the men going through all these similar type of situations.
Since it is starting to happen to woman, all be it from lesbian relationships but still woman some of the changes might trickle down to men.
I hope that it does, but do not expect to change much if anything for men.
For the comment about father vs. step-father, I fear the same...I have read over and over in another group women who have made all possible arrangements to ensure their current husbands keep custody of their children, in case they die...not because the father is bad, is not involved in the child's life, etc...but because they BELIEVE that because they had custody before, they are entitled to say who has custody when they die...nice...
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Note: The views expressed by some readers in the reader comments do not necessarily reflect those of Glenn Sacks. Their views are theirs alone--if you want mine, look at the blog post, not the blog comments. While blog commenters are given great freedom on this blog, there are some rules of moderation. To read those, click here.
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June 18th, 2008 at 8:33 pm
This case is so clear and so typical. It should serve as a warning to men, women straights and gays. Imagine using anti-gay laws for revenge. I've been away a while but this story places me firmly back into reality. I don't agree with the lesbian lifestyle but I really feel sympathy for the social mothers who are denied visitation. Discounts or excuses for the custodial mother, anyone?
June 18th, 2008 at 10:00 pm
I welcome gay marriages exactly for this reason. When fathers advocates can clearly demonstrate a preponderance of judicial rulings that are equitable between gay couples, judges will have little excuse for continuing punitive law against all social parents, including fathers.
June 18th, 2008 at 10:50 pm
One thing that's interesting about some of these cases is that the lesbian biological mothers are so vindictive towards their former partners that they will gladly use anti-gay laws as a way to drive them out of their children's lives
They will rationalize their choices the same way they rationalize the abuse of the courts they inflict on the fathers. Their partner had it coming, and it was all because she was the best parent for the children. Won't someone think of the children?
June 18th, 2008 at 10:51 pm
Won't someone think of closing their html tags?
June 18th, 2008 at 11:56 pm
Penumbrook
"I welcome gay marriages exactly for this reason. When fathers advocates can clearly demonstrate a preponderance of judicial rulings that are equitable between gay couples, judges will have little excuse for continuing punitive law against all social parents, including fathers."
Be careful what you wish for my friend.
The very nature of some one proclaiming a lesbian life style speaks volumes in itself. It should come as no surprise that the person will say and do anything to support their desirers. Once men make it clear that they will no longer take our current position, women will play a big part in changing the laws. Women (like men) want to be seen as working for good (certainly for the good of the children). As it stands the majority of the people are not paying attention. When this flood gate opens it will come as a complete surprise to many. That is why we can not bad mouth all women. Soon there will come a point when people must take a side and I care not to push anyone away who may be of help.
All the best
June 19th, 2008 at 12:14 am
This proves that the courts ARE fully capable of ruling against a woman.
As long as they are still ruling in favor of a woman.
How encouraging.
June 19th, 2008 at 1:57 am
This proves that the courts ARE fully capable of ruling against a woman.
As long as they are still ruling in favor of a woman.
How encouraging.
I fear the AP is correct again.
June 19th, 2008 at 8:27 am
AP:
This proves that the courts ARE fully capable of ruling against a woman.
As long as they are still ruling in favor of a woman.
How encouraging.
Yeah my head is still spinning on that one too.
June 19th, 2008 at 9:01 am
"When heterosexual women do this, our society makes excuses for them and assumes that the ex-husband must have done something bad to merit it. With these lesbian breakups we can see the truth much clearer--some women (straight or gay) are vindictive, and this vindictiveness drives them to purge their exes from their children’s lives."
Clearly, that kind of abuse (parental alienation) is domestic violence.
June 19th, 2008 at 10:01 am
My fear is that in establishing social parents as having equal rights with bio parents will put biological fathers at odds with step fathers for "equal rights" in parenting. now you have 2 against 1 in a court battle (parent AND social parent vs. parent) and you knock down a fathers default time to 1/3 to be "fair". I wish I could see the bright side of it like so many here.
June 19th, 2008 at 10:20 am
I bet NOW is pulling thier hair out over this one since a man is not involved they have no soapbox to rail against the verdict.
I dont think it makes a difference if its a lesbian "social" parent or a father. The courts are more then happy to slap a man with child support even if he is not the biological parent if he "creates a parental bond" with the child and I think that if a few more of these same sex couples start feeling the pain of fathers that awareness and perceptions will change.
Who knows??!!
June 19th, 2008 at 11:58 am
Penumbrook and AP said quite well... I see no reason to expound on the obvious. (Another one of those "this is a news flash why?" some of us have been seeing this for years; but now we have someone else here to tell us it's really okay to really believe what we really live with and really see every day)
Gunner ARetired
June 20th, 2008 at 2:03 pm
Just maybe, at least I am kind of hoping but not expecting that things might start to change for the men going through all these similar type of situations.
Since it is starting to happen to woman, all be it from lesbian relationships but still woman some of the changes might trickle down to men.
I hope that it does, but do not expect to change much if anything for men.
My 2 cents
July 21st, 2008 at 3:17 am
For the comment about father vs. step-father, I fear the same...I have read over and over in another group women who have made all possible arrangements to ensure their current husbands keep custody of their children, in case they die...not because the father is bad, is not involved in the child's life, etc...but because they BELIEVE that because they had custody before, they are entitled to say who has custody when they die...nice...