'When Ricky was 16, he met a girl named Amanda, who said she was the same age. They hit it off'...
March 12th, 2008 by Glenn Sacks, MA for Fathers & Families"When Ricky was 16, he went to a teen club and met a girl named Amanda, who said she was the same age. They hit it off and were eventually having sex. At the time Ricky thought it was a pretty normal high school romance.
"Two years later, Ricky is a registered sex offender, and his life is destroyed.
"Amanda turned out to be 13. Ricky was arrested, tried as an adult, and pleaded guilty to the charge of lascivious acts with a child, which is a class D felony in Iowa. It is not disputed that the sex was consensual, but intercourse with a 13-year-old is illegal in Iowa.
"Ricky was sentenced to two years probation and 10 years on the Iowa online sex offender registry. Ricky and his family have since moved to Oklahoma, where he will remain on the state’s public registry for life.
"Being labeled a sex offender has completely changed Ricky’s life, leading him to be kicked out of high school, thrown out of parks, taunted by neighbors, harassed by strangers, and unable to live within 2,000 feet of a school, day-care center or park. He is prohibited from going to the movies or mall with friends because it would require crossing state borders, which he cannot do without permission from his probation officer. One of Ricky’s neighbors called the cops on him, yelled and cursed at him, and videotaped him every time he stepped outside, Ricky said.
"'It affects you in every way,' he said. 'You’re scared to go out places. You’re on the Internet, so everybody sees your picture.'"
Excellent article by Hanna Ingber Win on the way innocent teenage boys can have their lives destroyed for relationships which, in any normal country, nobody would think twice about.
The story is Is Ricky Really a Sex Offender? California’s registry for life may soon include promiscuous kids (2/20/08).
Thanks to Michael, a reader, for sending the story.
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March 12th, 2008 at 1:48 pm
Where is her responsibility for lying about her age? He should not have been found guilty because his intent was not to have sex with a 13 year old.
b
March 12th, 2008 at 1:57 pm
I think I understand our legal system now:
When men lie, that is fraud and shall be punished.
When women lie, the man who believed her shall be punished.
And don't even get me started on the sex offender registry...
John Stossel is going to run a program on this issue on Friday. I can't remember the name of his show, however :( Last Friday he highlighted a case where the mother of a 15 year old girl went to press charges on her19 year old BF after the two had been fighting. BF was charged with statutory rape, is a life-long sex offender registrant, and still faces the consequences of the legal action. What ran thru my mind as I was watching the clip: I know plenty of cases like that one where younger girl below the age of consent has long term relationship with boy who's above. Parents know about the sex, but don't do anything until they fight or break up. So then the hammer comes down on the boy. But what about the parents of the girl? Do they have no accountability for allowing the relationship to happen before they pressed charges? Are they not guilty of child neglect or sexual child abuse by neglect? If protecting these girls was the issue, wouldn't they charge the parents too?
March 12th, 2008 at 2:01 pm
This is why I'm moving to my wife's hometown in Japan in 6 months when my son is born. The US is no longer a safe or rational environment to raise children. Either your boys will be emasculated and taught to think they're evil and defective human beings or your daughters will grow up believing that the world owes them because they're female.
Whether it be forcing my boy to drink ritalin, teaching him to hate men or tagging him as a sex offender for doing something that was normal recently, there's just too much to lose by raising him here.
March 12th, 2008 at 2:02 pm
"which, in any normal country, nobody would think twice about."
This country is so abnormal in so many ways, and almost all of these abnormalities benefit politicians and/or the judiciary and/or the legal and related professions profiting from the legal/justice industries.
This country is worth leaving, and more and more sensible people are doing just that.
If you have sons, you would be crazy to not consider getting them out of the U.S. and established elsewhere.
March 12th, 2008 at 2:03 pm
Is it Give Me A Break? (John Stossel's show)???
March 12th, 2008 at 2:04 pm
Well this is what the feminists have pushed for .. I don't need to explain to anyone on this site of course ... but there is something the feminists forget .. they have a child and it lets say it happens to be a boy ... that boy turns into a man ... and the one child love so much is now subject to their feminist tyranny .. ........
I wonder if the "family" is a single mom ... lets go with the stats on divorce and say family is single mom and other siblings ... its come full circle ....
March 12th, 2008 at 2:07 pm
Demonspawn: How about the pregnancy of Jamie Spears (Brittany Spears' 16-year old sister)?
I saw her described on most news stations as the "long-time lover" of her now 19-year old boyfriend. LONG-TIME LOVER?!?!?!
While I've seen some appropriately negative reactions to that situation, she is still doing her show on Nickelodeon (Zoey 101)... and the fact that her parents permitted her to be the "long-time lover" of someone who has effectively commited statuatory rape is scarier still. Sadly, the media who portray these stars as idols all too often - are also responsible for the soft-shoe terminology "long-time lovers."
In my mind, "long-time" in that context means several years. Good grief.
March 12th, 2008 at 2:34 pm
John Stossel reported on this issue recently on his network TV show ABC's (20/20 ?).
March 12th, 2008 at 2:41 pm
A new government anti-male law.
"...anyone [any male] with droopy pants that show skin or underwear faces legal action. The first offense carries a $150 fine or community service. A second infraction carries a $300 fine or more community service."
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/politics/content/local_news/epaper/2008/03/11/0311rivcharter.html
March 12th, 2008 at 3:03 pm
John Stossel reported on this issue recently on his network TV show ABC's (20/20 ?).
Aye, that was the program. Thanks. The follow up is this Friday, if I remember correctly.
and the fact that her parents permitted her to be the "long-time lover" of someone who has effectively commited statuatory rape is scarier still.
Depends on the state. In some there is a hard line at a certain age (Michigan, 16). In others there is a bubble around the age of consent where as long as the pair are within a certain range it is still ok (no examples at the top of my head).
March 12th, 2008 at 3:07 pm
So what happens if a thirteen year old girl has sex with a thirteen year old boy? Are they both going to be registered sex offenders for the rest of their life, or does this only apply to males? And then fourteen year olds, fifteen years olds, or whatever. Have there EVER been any seventeen year old females arrested or prosecuted for having sex with boys younger than themselves, and tried 'as adults'? I have seen two incidents of 'statuatory rape' publicized in which the predator was a female in my entire life.
March 12th, 2008 at 3:15 pm
In an equitable society that did not infantilize women, the girl would also have been convicted of "lewd and lascivious" behavior with a minor (fully intended), and would likewise be listed on the "public perverts" list. Interesting that when it comes to protecting the "virtue" of our "maidens" (note that at present, one in four teen girls are infected with an STD), we are willing to ignore the otherwise well-known fact that girls develop physically, emotionally, psychologically and socially at a faster rate than boys, such that a 13 year old girl and a 16 year old boy are at near the same level of development.
But, having a penis makes a person so dangerous, we have to nip all of this normal heterosexuality in the bud. Better to destroy a boy's life than take a risk that he otherwise might grow up to be a responsible family man, after all. We just can't be too careful when it comes to the maidens -- those pure and delicate vessels of life and goodness. : - (
March 12th, 2008 at 3:18 pm
Thanks Glenn. I'm in the journalism class for the college magazine this semester and I've been considering doing an article on the campus rape myth hysteria I see in flyers, on bulletin boards, etc. You get just a little flavor of what it must have been like for the Duke lacrosse players. Of course, if I do the article I'll be vilified by the campus gender feminist contingent. Still, all things considered, I can't even imagine what this young man is going through. It is really time for every good man in America to speak up, write on, act up and confront the gender feminist witch-hunt that is plaguing so many innocent males today. If we all just did a little. If we all just did what we can, things would be vastly different so what is holding us back, chivlary, fear of feminists, lack of time, apathy? No seriously, what is allowing this rampant misandry to continue in America for one more day?
March 12th, 2008 at 3:19 pm
Duy said: "This is why I'm moving to my wife's hometown in Japan in 6 months when my son is born. The US is no longer a safe or rational environment to raise children. Either your boys will be emasculated and taught to think they're evil and defective human beings or your daughters will grow up believing that the world owes them because they're female".
I totally envy you Duy. I unfortunately don't have enough money to move to a new country. And is sends shivers down my spine to think that if I have children, any boys that I have will be raised in such a femisupremacist environment. I have always thought that the statitory rape penalties when it comes to people of close ages can be very draconian in many states. I heard of a case where in Indiana, a guy who was 18 was sentenced to 2 years in prison for having sex with his girlfriend who was 16. Now he probably even has to register as a sex offender. I think that this is a great injustice, but I don't see these type of cases going away. In fact, I think that we will see more boys going to jail over this kind of thing. Boys are under great attack in American society. If you have a boy and you have the luxury of raising him in another country, I would probably advise that.
March 12th, 2008 at 3:25 pm
Interesting:
1) an adult club owner has a "teen night"
2) a 13 year old's parents allow her to go to a club
3) a 16 years old's parents allow him to go to a club
4) A 13 year old lies about her age
5) A 16 year old and a 13 year old decide to have sex (consent is not disputed)
5) Assumed: A 13 year olds parents complain to police/DA
6) A legally trained adult prosecutes a 16 year old on a technicality rather
than spirit of the law
7) a 16 year old boy gets abused by the system.
All parties walk away unscathed except the 16 year old boy.
March 12th, 2008 at 3:29 pm
Say your prayers for this kid because the trauma they are putting him through he will:
1. Never get into a good college
2. Trust women ever again
March 12th, 2008 at 3:41 pm
...what was that I heard about America not being one of those fascist police states?
March 12th, 2008 at 3:51 pm
People here were saying leaving America. But go where? Glenn has plenty of posts of insanity in other countries. There seems like there's no escape.
March 12th, 2008 at 3:57 pm
I'll repeat what I've long said: The lethal combination of women-first feminist and misguided chivalrous right wing Christians have created a legal climate more repressive than in the 1950s.
In any normal society, the law would have made considerations for circumstance and let hte kid off with a wrist-slap. But this is not a normal society. This is a society WITH ONE OUT OF EVERY ONE HUNDRED ADULTS INCARCERATED.
It was great living in American, which ended around 1985. I'm not sure where I live now -- maybe it's the Soviet Union revived except for the freedoms they had.
March 12th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
There are no new frontiers. I had hopes for New Zealand, which shares the post with Sweden for the country with the lowest level of corruption. However, I researched family law in New Zealand and Sweden, and the corruption is already there.
We have no choice but to fight, to the death if necessary, for our right to life, liberty, and family.
Fight where you are, fight every day. I am paying 25% of my income into the black hole of Family Law, so I why not put more into trying to kill Family Law, and incarcerate its depraved operators?
March 12th, 2008 at 4:12 pm
I used to subscribe to the idea that a man cannot be 'raped' by a woman. I have since changed my mind. I was thinking in terms of the physical act. If a man doesn't want to get it on, and is uninterested, his 'equipment' doesn't respond. The historical term for a lewd or lavicious woman was "seductress", the "ess" having been added to describe a female because of course the original term was only for males "seducer". With laws that say someone that had sex, enjoyed it, and had no remorse about it can be considered as 'raped', it seems that it is unsafe to have sex at all. If you use this logic, humans would die out as a species unless pregnancy only happened via turkey baster...
March 12th, 2008 at 4:18 pm
Stephen M Weiss Says: March 12th, 2008 at 4:02 pm
"There are no new frontiers."
I lament this at times as well. Time for a privately funded moon colony?
March 12th, 2008 at 4:23 pm
I used to subscribe to the idea that a man cannot be 'raped' by a woman. I have since changed my mind. I was thinking in terms of the physical act. If a man doesn't want to get it on, and is uninterested, his 'equipment' doesn't respond.
Yes it can and does. This is a myth. Sometimes, even under great stress, the body has normal physiological reactions, particularly where sexual stimulation is concerned... FOR BOTH SEXES.
March 12th, 2008 at 4:30 pm
Almost any sane person will agree that jailing an underage boy for having sex with an underage girl who lied is wrong. The problem is that no one cares.
Politicians can pander to over protective parents with a 'not my daughter' attitude, and no one will dare call them on their bull excrement. Because the age of consent is one of this generations sacred cows. And no one will argue otherwise for fear of being labeled a pedophile and persecuted themselves.
March 12th, 2008 at 4:42 pm
These BLANKET sex offender laws are very dangerous. This 16 yr old boy is going to be marked for life and it will affect every aspect of his life. The laws need to be changed to handle each case with a degree of intellegance. When a young man can have his life destroyed because he believed a young girl is unacceptable to say the least.
A male child can get the same sentence as a grown man , however a grown woman can rape/molest a male child gets a rape/molestation discount.
March 12th, 2008 at 5:18 pm
I used to subscribe to the idea that a man cannot be 'raped' by a woman. I have since changed my mind. I was thinking in terms of the physical act. If a man doesn't want to get it on, and is uninterested, his 'equipment' doesn't respond.
A very common misconception. I remember many an embarrassing time when I had a sudden erection during school and i was afraid of people seeing it. Women tend to think that male puberty is a glorious time free of akwardness and shyness.
March 12th, 2008 at 5:51 pm
There clearly should be a defence to statutory rape in cases where the alleged victim deliberately misled the accused into believing that she was over the legal age.
As for people leaving America, a lot of these problems are fairly widespread in most developed nations. So there are not a lot of places to escape to.
March 12th, 2008 at 7:56 pm
Jake Says:
March 12th, 2008 at 3:29 pm
Say your prayers for this kid because the trauma they are putting him through he will:
1. Never get into a good college
2. Trust women ever again
= = =
I pray not but they could have just created another male to perpetuate their statistics
b
March 12th, 2008 at 10:06 pm
If you're going to connect the cause of "father's rights" with defending this kind of stupidity, you're going to have a looooong row to hoe.
NOT real smart at all.
March 12th, 2008 at 10:10 pm
Don't get me wrong, I'm WITH you in your fight for justice for fathers and their kids, but this is just a "non-connect"
March 12th, 2008 at 10:37 pm
Causefighter,
we are not just fighting for justice for fathers. We are fighting for justice for all men and boys.
This boy was basically duped into this by a girl who lied. There are two issues here. One is that where a girl lies by claiming she is over the legal age, there is clearly no criminal intent on the part of the accused to commit an offence. The other is that where teens are involved, and the age gap is relatively small, the law should perhaps treat it differently. No-one here is suggesting that men should be free to screw around with underage girls without any penalty.
March 12th, 2008 at 11:26 pm
The Human Rights Watch report cited in the original article mentions that federal law can in some instances demand that 10-year-olds be placed on a sex offender registry. The report cites an instance of a landlord kicking a mother and an 11-year-old boy out of an apartment because the landlord found that the boy was on the online sex offender registry.
My fear is that bogus "sexual harassment" accusations against boys, such as the famous case of the 4-year-old accused after hugging a female school staffer, might one day be added to the list of offenses requiring placement on the registry. Feminists just might push for that, and they seem to be getting their way a lot with Congress lately. When it happens, remember that Krampitz said it here first.
In addition, juvenile records are increasingly being "unsealed" concerning sexual offenses, not just because of these new laws, but also the continued existence of old databases of legal cases. A few months back I read online of a 14-year-old boy who was busted for having consensual sex with a girl his same age. (Of course, nothing was done to punish her.) Now, 10 years later at age 24, his records have appeared online from old databases and he now has to explain to employers and others what he did at 14.
March 12th, 2008 at 11:54 pm
Anecdotal ad on. College of Staten Island under the CUNY umbrella, admitted a young man this last fall, knowing that he had served his sentence for a sex crime and was a registered offender. Certain elements of the campus leaked this young man's status on the first day of classes and the President recanted the admission offer and dismissed this gentleman from campus. I do not know what the specifics were of this gentlemen's particular offense, that was never officially released. I was struck by the fact that he had served his sentence, and was attempting to assimilate back into society, yet was banned. The two boy's in Oregon last year, the case Ed cited, the five year old in Missouri- the list goes on. Physical assaults in schools quash by leaps and bounds the amount of sex assaults (what have become defined to represent as such), yet somehow the kiss and chase on the playground has become the target of singling out boys an punishing them for life. A genuine human rights offense. The awkward ally in this is the ACLU who has begun to take on some of these cases.
March 13th, 2008 at 12:33 am
[...] In my recent blog post 'When Ricky was 16, he met a girl named Amanda, who said she was the same age. They hit it off', I discussed a horrific case where a 16-year-old boy is being persecuted and branded a sex offender [...]
March 13th, 2008 at 7:18 am
Okay, not to play devil's advocate or anything, but I must question if they had sex the night they met, or did they have a "relationship?" In the first paragraph it states, "they hit it off and were eventually having sex." If they dated, how long, and what were the circumstances? Unless we sat on this jury, we don't know the whole story. If they spent time together, then I have a hard time believing that he thought she was 13. There is more to this story.
Now, do I agree that he is a "sex offender?" No. Unless he turned 18. That is another question. The story says "2 years later......" I am all for protecting innocent males. And females. Maybe he is innocent. What I do believe though is that because it was consensual, he should not be labled as a sex offender. And, if it was determined to be consensual, that is where the degree of the crime would need to be assessed. Actually the appropriate charges probably should have been brought against her parents for child neglect. That makes more sense to me.
March 13th, 2008 at 7:57 am
Okay, I just read the story on the link. There was no jury trial. Nobody knows the truth. This is why you don't plead out just for the sake of pleading out. Of course this mother is upset. There was no sentencing by the judge. There was an acceptence of a plea. The judge imposed a sentence that was agreed upon by the defendant and the State. How is this an injustice? This does just add to the feminuts stand that males are penis wielding idiots. Stupidity is not a defense. My theory is go down with a fight, then if you are found guilty and sentenced, you stood your ground. I would have fought tooth and nail for my son if I felt he was innocent. That is what they should have done.
March 13th, 2008 at 8:14 am
"There are no new frontiers."
I lament this at times as well. Time for a privately funded moon colony?
Lewis I was thinking exactly the same thing! Although I think the moon's too close... I'm well up for starting a colony on an entirely new planet.
I don't know which country I'd go to if I could.
I'd be careful of the sentiment that Japan is a great place of freedom for men. The suicide rates there are extremely high among men, they have a culture of working yourself to death. Have you ever read any of their manga, or watched their anime? They are full of images of women beating well meaning men up for saying the wrong thing, or unwittingly seeing them naked. With shouts of 'pervert' they beat the guy down even as he profusely apologises for the misunderstanding. See for example Love Hina.
More examples of Japan's not so great for men:
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9904E0D81439F93AA25755C0A960958260 (read past NYT's usual bias)
http://dapook.blogspot.com/search?q=japanese+divorce
Japanese women cashed in a lot of their husbands during their depression.
March 13th, 2008 at 8:48 am
The pessimist side of me says that this registry nonsense will go on until a young man like this is beaten to death by his 'community minded' neighbors or classmates.
@Bill C
Perhaps we are up in arms with insuffiecient information. I ask though, "Why is he more responsible for this 'crime' than she is?"
Leaving the whole 'registered' aspect out of it the underage MALE is being held to a different standard of accountability than the underage FEMALE. Of course we look 'crazy' to the feminists we are asking that men and women be equal in the eyes of the law.
What if it had been a sixteen year old girl and the thirteen year old girl?
March 13th, 2008 at 8:50 am
Thank you for posting Ricky's story here. I am his mother. It is important we post his story everywhere and tell it and keep fire under it as I meet legislators here in Oklahoma City on May 1st who do not seem to think this is outrageous what is happening to my son. Email me speak out I will take your letters to OKC as well as Iowa. Email: a_political_prisoner@yahoo.com share this story with families and teens you know they are at risk in California with age of consent being eighteen. Please you could save another youg man from this nightmare. I am currently in process of building Ricky a website visit it please: http://freericky.tripod.com also listen to my live interview on Dori Monson show last Friday March 7 from noon to one. The link to locate archive is http://www.mynorthwest.com I appreciate all of you for posting Ricky's story everywhere and hope news stations and radio stations will pick i tup. Again thanks from a mom who is gonna fight to save all our sons
March 13th, 2008 at 8:56 am
Sadly there has been a young man killed by his community for the same situation. When folks see a registry page, like Ricky's, they do not see the truth he was lied too or it was consensual they only see the charge the state has put on him not the details. I wish I could think of this young man's name who died violently and sadly it was teenagers who killed him. I fear everyday my son will be killed due to this as all folks see is a violent crime page with his name and picture and adddress...I can only pray folks will help me by writing letters and heling me demand change.
Also, Friday, March 14 ABC 20/20 is havng a special called Age of Consent (check your local times). It will present more young men lives ruined by these laws for consensual sex. How many more young men are going to be sacrificial lambs for politicians? When will Mark Lunsford speak out and help pass Romeo and Juliet laws since his son was giving this in Ohio last year? The Adam Walsh Act (federal) has a Romeo and Juliet law when will politicians enact this federal law as many I speak to are unaware of section 111. We must educate families, teenagers, parents, teachers this could be anyone of our son's and we the people must stop this crime from happening to any more boys.
March 13th, 2008 at 8:58 am
Engineering problems aside on getting to the 'Final Frontier,' George, I suspect no government would allow such a thing to pass without sticking their nose into it. So much for the point of leaving.
As Malcolm Reynolds asked, "That's what a government's for isn't it? To get in a man's way?"
March 13th, 2008 at 9:03 am
@ Lewis,
If you read my both of my posts, at no time did I indicate that he is guilty of anything other than not defending himself as diligently as he could have. Or his parents defending him as I read it. I agree that she is just as responsible, but I will take it a step further and blame her parents for this mess. Yep, her parents. Pleading guilty of something does not warrant sympathy from me. Defending your child, or yourself is serious business and I don't think they did enough.
March 13th, 2008 at 9:09 am
My son story can be read here: http://www.ethicaltreatment.org/mary.htm he and her hit it off and were sleeping together pretty qucikly. She came over one day a few weeks after he met her and told me at that point she was fourteen but to not tell Ricky as he be mad. Well I told my son they broke up. Weeks later she ran off from home and this is when all this began.
I do not blame this girl as her and Ricky were children and having sex is wrong but labeling him a offender for life is a crime against my child. He was charged as a adult they told him he had to make all decisions in court. His attorney told us point blank we "cannot win a jury trial as he admitted he had sex twice" even tho" the girl admitted she lied" and "it was consensual"..we were just shocked at the law.
So the public defender told Ricky as well as judge a deferred means "no conviction" and his record be exsponged. He was told as well no registration but five minutes before meeting judge he was told thelaw says he has ot register under a deferred in Iowa just not follow the statute of lifetime probation/parole since its a deferred. Ricky was horrified and angry and went into courtroom balling. Judge tried to calm Ricky down and told him on applications he can say no to "convicted of a felony" so we thought ok we can do this we can give Ricky our love and strength to get thru this. Unbeknownst to us (yes we were stupid;) this deferred meant nothing.
His bakground checks still show a felony conviction no word on a deferred and he cannot find work...He has been accused of lying on applications and his probation last week told him to mark yes on convicted of a felony. Why the heck give him a deferred? Its all a lie and setup IMO now.
If Ricky cannot find work to pay off his fines by September he will not be removed from probation. In Iowa you cannot be more then two years older then a person under age of consent or you are breaking the law...when do they teach ourkids age of consent laws? or the fact they can be made to register as sex offenders? Where are they being educated?
If I could go back I would fight but we were told Ricky would get twenty years since he admitted he had sex with her and she was only thirteen. He told the truth and ruined his life and even now has a hard time dealing with how he is treated. I plead folks to write letters to my politicians in Iowa Keith Kreiman and Oklahma John Auffet, Gus Blackwell, Jim Wilson, Lucky Lamons...help me save Ricky's life cause at seventeen his life was over before it ever began....
March 13th, 2008 at 9:42 am
These are the kinds of stories that should be a part of every parents' "sex talk" with their children. If that doesn't scare children into abstinance, nothing will.
GB my father's lesson which was quite simple: "Keep your d**k in your pants. If you get someone pregnant, I'll chop it off."
A little extreme? Perhaps. Did the lesson work? Yes. I certainly did my share of "heavy petting" and stuff in my day, but getting someone pregnant (for me) was a fear worse than death in my teenage years.
March 13th, 2008 at 10:06 am
The difference between the application of the sharia in some middle-eastern countries and the law in the US when it comes to biological driven sexual behaviour of teenagers is slowly but unmistakenly diminishing. There is some sexual difference regarding the severity of the punishment, with the sharia favouring the boys and the US laws favouring the girls. But in the end, it's the trend. Scaring. In the middle ages we used tar and feathers and nowadays we use the internet. We have come a long way.
March 13th, 2008 at 10:35 am
As I said on the other thread ..........
If someone gives you a car and hands you the keys, do you automatically ASSUME they're telling you the truth that its their car to give you?????????
WAKE UP!!!!!!!!
People lie .......................DON'T BE STUPID.
QUIT WASTING SPACE ON THIS NON-ISSUE
March 13th, 2008 at 10:57 am
Causefighter,
I for one have no clue how your comparison is in any way relevant. Yes, people lie, that does not make the people they lie to responsible for those lies. A 16 year old girl having sex (perhaps unfortunately) is not nearly as out of character as someone walking around giving away cars. There is MUCH less reason for suspicion. I think the proper term is mitigating circumstances for situations like this. Punishment for crime is there to disuade people from breaking the law...this young man did not break the law intentionally, he was coerced into it. The sex register is there to protect possible future victims. Is this individual in any way a threat?
You are also missing a huge part of the argument. Why, in today's society, is the only way for a young man to be treated as an adult to break "THE LAW"? How did he magically become and adult for prosecution? If he would have been aquitted does he suddenly become a child again or now that he has been convicted is he recognized by society as an adult at 16/17? Can he vote, can he drink, can he go to x rated movies? Does being tried as an adult result in immediate emmancipation? He, magically, was as responsible as an adult for this portion of his life...where is the consistency?
March 13th, 2008 at 10:58 am
causefighter, I am sorry you think this is a NON-ISSUE.
This is a BIG-ISSUE. It is a young man that is marked for life. It shows the inequity of the laws where they stand on men and boys. Compared to the laws protecting woman. They say the sex offenders have to pay. However a female sex offender doesn't have to pay. The laws will come up with an excuse to keep a woman out of jail, or off the sex offender list.
BUT, they will crucify a young boy that was dating a young girl and having consensual sex? Surely you can see the inbalance of the laws that protect woman at all areas and will sacrifice even a child , just because he is a male.
The example they use in the story from the father who's daughters were violenly raped, does NOT compare to what is happening to this young man and the many like him. To use a violent example to compare two young kids dating and doing what dating kids do, is a cover-up to justify wanting ALL boys to pay the same way. Regardless of the details.
You ARE a part of the overall problem causefight, when you can say this is a non-cause. SHAME ON YOU.
March 13th, 2008 at 11:15 am
Mary, I am sorry that you are going through this. My point is no matter what, pleading guilty is exactly that, pleading guilty. I know attornies that recommend pleading guilty for different reasons. The truth is you had a public defender that saw no hope in your son's case. Then entered in an agreement that was not throughly explained to YOU, or your son. This happens quite frequently. I would suggest an appeal. That could be difficult in that an agreement was made, and I would get legal help from an attorney in your area. I do find it hard to believe that it was after the fact when you found out the sex offender status. If that can be proven, grounds for an appeal might exist. As much as we love our children, sometimes the mistakes that they make can be disastrous for the whole family. Reality is, he had sex with a 13 year old, admitted it, then plead guilty.
March 13th, 2008 at 11:22 am
causefighter, I found this on the http://www.ethicaltreatment.org/mary.htm
In order for states to receive full federal funding for law enforcement efforts, they are required to do the following to all such juveniles, as well as those convicted or adjudicated for non-consensual sexual behavior:
~ include them in a new national public registry of sex offenders
~ require them to produce a DNA sample
~ subject them to electronic monitoring for the duration of their supervised release
~ include them on the public registry and monitor them electronically for the rest of their lives if the violation is/was a second offense or if the other juvenile or victim is/was under 12.
This explains why the states are hanginjg our children out to dry. Money talks.... Don't get me wrong, if the child - boy or girl - does a sexual crime against another child, then that child is a sex offender. BUT, when 2 children are dating the male child IS NOT a sex offender and does not deserve being labeled as such for the rest of his life.
March 14th, 2008 at 11:21 pm
The thing about age-of-consent laws in relation to teenagers is that a lot of people that age are barely aware of these sort of legal issues. If I think back to when I was 16, suppose if a 15 yo girl had approached me for sex. I doubt that the legal implications would have even occurred to me. The possibility that I could be branded a sex offender for life is too horrifying to contemplate.
Yes, I know that ignorance of the law is no excuse. But where minors are concerned, there should be more allowances made for these situations.
March 15th, 2008 at 12:57 am
Folks,
Misandry is misandry is misandry is misandry is misandry is misandry. Whever it rears its ugly Hyrdas Head, it's still misandry. From male bashing commercials on TV to prosecutors persecuting boys for having sex at 16 to allowing women to Falsely Accuse adults with impunity to turning a blind eye as Prosecutors run amok with fabricated evidence and sensational media releases to the media splashing the accuseds name and life history across the headlines with updates every hour to the US Federal passing laws funding all this... to the US Congress allocating 80 billion dollars to women gender specific health issues in the same bill they fund 500 million into male gender health to company EEO policies as practiced to (I know a mid level exec who was terminated over 'allegations' of porn on his work computer by a temp hire... that even the company IT team could find no trace of. It was later determined that she had done this at previous and subsequent temp employs.)... etc.
Misandry is misandry is misandry is misandry is misandry.
Does anyone remember the process used to strip firearms owners of their rights to own and possess firearms? It started with gun 'A' and moved to gun 'B' on to gun 'C' to... etc.
How do you move a mountain? One pebble at a time.
Now we have to put that mountain back. We need to stop placating ourselves with "is this a pertinent issue?" crap and recognize the gender bias paradigm for what it is: MISANDRY.
Step 1. Educate yourselves, Learn the details and specifics of a few False Allegations cases, and be able to summarize a half dozen more. Learn the specific of a few False Paternity cases and be able to summarize a half dozen more. Learn the specifics of a few Wrongful Conviction cases involving prosecutorial misconduct and be able to summarize a half dozen more. Learn the US DoH&H CMRs, learn the US DoJ/BJS NCRs, learn the data and the stats and be able to cite and source them. And speak of it whenever and wherever you can get an ear to listen. BUT LEARN TO PRESENT IT FROM A FACT BASED NON-EMOTIONAL PERSPECTIVE AND KEEP YOUR OPINIONS TO YOURSELF.
Why?
Simple: one can debate opinions... not verifiable documented facts.
(And be prepared to be absolutely vilified for not conforming to the feminist approved ideological doctrine.)
Gunner Retired
March 15th, 2008 at 2:48 am
Hi, I am a blogger in Singapore. I agree what you said and here I post the new of sex offender in Singapore...
March 18th, 2008 at 11:04 am
Bill C,
I rarely comment on these blogs, but after reading your post, I had to respond. I am the 44yo father of an almost 18yo son and, until last year, shared your belief about defending my child at all costs. After my experience with my local police and justice system (Northern Virginia), I have lost almost all trust in the judicial system and the "spirit" of the law.
My son, along with 12 other boys 13 to 18 years old, was involved in an incident that left a young man seriously injured with a fractured eye socket and several stitches to his head (he was released from the hospital the same day). Although this was a 1-on-1 altercation involving 2 boys in an after-school fight, the local police and D.A. charged all of bystanders with Felony malicious wounding and, for good measure, also added the "by a mob' charge for the expected reaction by the general public.
Now I don't know about you, but I was involved (directly and as a bystander) in many of these "pre-scheduled" after-school fights as a young man - although none of them turned out as badly as this one. To make a long story short, EVERY one of the bystanders plead guilty to misdemeaner assault/battery charges of various degrees, with various sentences of community service and probation (my son returns to court next week to end his probation). These guilty pleas were entered because the D.A. was threatening sentences of 5 to 20 years as an example for the community (this was told to us by every defense lawyer we consulted). The cost of a good criminal defense lawyer was upwards of $25K. One quote was for $50K! My ex-wife and I just do not have type of money. In the end, our total cost to agree to the guilty plea was more than $10K.
Believe me, if we had the available finances, we would have fought these charges tooth and nail. However, in the end the only justice truly served was the short jail time (90days) given to the actual participant, an expensive lesson in being at the wrong place at the wrong time, and the loss of any respect of the judicial system by 12 young men and their families.
My heart goes out to Mary and her family. Please continue to provide the support Ricky so desparately needs.
Thanks for letting me get all of this off my chest.
March 18th, 2008 at 1:01 pm
This is a minor point, but I am curious. Is the club itself, where the two met, being held in any way responsible?
The quote was, "...my son age 16, went to a Iowa teen club for 16-20 year olds."
Ignorance of the law may be no excuse, but isn't it logical for a 16 year old boy, in a club for 16-20 year olds, to assume that any female he met in there would be at least 16 years old?
Yes, the female lied, and should be held accountable for that fact. Yet, I am curious as to how she was allowed into that club in the first place.
I ask as we have teen clubs where I live, and you must show ID to enter, to prove you are in the correct age range. Some nights are for 13-17 year olds, and other nights are for 17-20 year olds. To allow someone outside that age range -- even a parent looking for their child -- gets you a huge fine, at minimum. More than three "offenses" gets you shut down.
May 29th, 2008 at 12:34 pm
[...] Similarly, statutory rape laws–whose purpose is to prevent 30-year-old men from having sex with 15-year-old girls–are increasingly being used to target teen boys who have sex with girls who are in similar age brackets. One good example can be found here. [...]
June 6th, 2008 at 7:51 pm
When will adults who represent the LAW start making sound decisions instead of being pressure to "feel good"
I am sick and tired of the double standard.
1. If a guy walks without clothing around in his home and the windows are open, a woman on the street can say he is exposing himself to her. If the girl is doing the EXACT same thing, but it is a guy that sees her from the street, he is a "peeping tom"
2. In a domestic argument, if the authorities show up, the guy will be arrested. This is regardless of whether or not he has done anything but protecting himself. (then the libel follows). Usually the woman is declared the victim.
3. If a father who has legal right to his kids, stands outside of his ex-wife's house at pick up time, and she refuses to surrender the kids, the guy will be asked to leave ( I know this happened to me more than once) The woman will then be treated to free legal recourse by the state to prosecuted or further penalize the ex-husband. (Check your state laws)
Now that we have established that Justice is NOT blind, and that public pressure does affect the outcome of the legal profession, my question is this, are minors really minors?
We see day in and day out minors being prosecuted as adults for a variety of infractions (some very serious crimes), yet there is no standard on what category they fall in except by the interpretation of the Prosecutor.
Are they minors, or are they not.
When it comes to sex, a scientifically known human instinct, legislators are fighting emotion more than the law. When my friend's daughter was raped by a teenaged boy, the father did not have access to the police report because he might have been the perpetrator. When the investigation revealed that both were minors, the case was dropped because they were sure the could not get a prosecution.
Do both kids get the protection of so called "Child protection laws" because they are minors?
The young man that raped the girl was not held accountable for anything. the girl got no assistance. So will a public outcry of outrage help either kid?
Can the law be written differently?
If it is your kid, will you be able to let it go? Will you be able to act sanely, or will you go as blind as the Law has become?
June 9th, 2008 at 9:04 pm
NickS,
That's a great point. I'm a 16-year old who just recently realized I had no idea what the age of consent was in my state. I'm glad that I checked, because it turned out it's just a flat sixteen years, with no moving "bubble" like I assumed there would be. This is definitely something they should talk about in schools; imagine that , an assembly that's actually useful.
June 11th, 2008 at 7:46 am
[...] of a child after taking pictures of her 4 and 6 year old granddaughters naked. More recently, a 13 year old girl and a 16 year old boy had sex, and, despite that the 13 year old told the boy she was the same age as him, the boy was arrested, [...]
June 12th, 2008 at 10:48 am
Robert Says:
June 6th, 2008 at 7:51 pm
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NICE! That is right on the mark!
b
June 12th, 2008 at 10:59 am
Welcome to the snake pit, bug, LOL.
b